Austria-Hungary - Family History & Genealogy Message Board

Re: Stephen & Gertrude Lucas - from Austria/Croatia? How to trace back to there?

TilmanB — 2010-03-12 10:46:20Z

Mark,

parts of Croatia back then were Italian, so Lucas, while not a Croatian name, would make sense.

You can only trace them back following the leads you find under US documents, forms or private papers, in order to know where to start looking - you need a town or place name.

I'll move this over to the Austria-Hungary board where it probably does belong.

Tilman

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

rmacek1 — 2010-03-12 00:33:58Z

Hi Rich, I know that now. It was sent to me by a third party and all I could see was one question in the very start of the thread

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-11 19:58:42Z

Hi Bob:

Not sure what you mean here, but there's a lot of information in this post about surnames and locations.

Basically I'm looking for
IVANIK from Salgotarjan, Nograd megye
BANICZKY from Sarszentlorinc, Tolna megye

Thanks,
Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

rmacek1 — 2010-03-10 19:28:41Z

Hi Richard,
Right off hand I would say surname and village of origin.

Bob

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ZlaticaBeca — 2010-03-10 18:20:44Z

ainsrow1

Do not know German but can see Francisca IWANIK on top and IVANIK Franciska {Baglyas not sure of that word} and Salgotarjan on the bottom of the document.
p.s. there were some BAGLYASs that arrived NY EI so it is a surname that I see but of course, I can be way off in reading it as a surname. :)

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

LajosReich — 2010-03-10 13:56:02Z

Richard,
I repeat: Csehország means Czechcountry, as same as eg Franciaország means French country, Magyarország means Magyarcountry.
I am not sure, what was the name in English of the Czechland, maybe Czechis Kingdom (the crown was on Habsburg head)
Otthoniskola gave you very nice informations. One Krompach is in the Czechis Republic (Czechis Kingdom earlier).Korompa, what founded by German industrial experts, and really, its German name was given by them as Krompach, earlier, later it went to be Korompa. It is not possible to close out, Julianna is from Krompach, in the Historical Hungary.
I repeat you: Krompachy is only a Slovakized name of Korompa/Krompach.

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-10 08:55:09Z

Hi Lajos,

Yes I looked at the maps you sent. I am still conflicted over whether "Krompach" shown on the document is Krompachy in Slovakia or Krompach in Czech Republic. I have ordered microfilm of Krompachy church records through LDS and will search for baptism of Julianna Murgacs/Murgach (I have her birthdate as 16 May 1866. It will take a couple of weeks to get that information. (I could not locate any records for Krompach, Czech Rep - maybe a nearby town?

Thanks,
Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-10 08:46:21Z

Hi otthoniskola:

Thanks for your comments.

In Julianna Terez's baptism certificate I also saw what looked like "Bikabikk" as their address. In fact I also have a letter from Francisca Ivanik in 1912 sent from Saltogarjan to her son Wilhelm Ivanik in America that shows what looks like "Likabik" at the top. I had never been able to locate that place. The web page you sent clearly shows "Baglyasalja" and "Bikabikk". Thanks for that. But what is "köszantelep" seen below "Bikabikk"? I understand "telep" means settlement/yard/establishment.

A previous translation of the Hungarian note at the bottom of Wilhelm's baptism certificate is as follows:
"This is proof that the mother Ivanik Franciska lives in the city of Baglyasallya, and is not married and is single. Salgotarjan, 1883. Father Markovik Marton." I had identified Baglyasallya as Baglyasalja, which is very near Salgotarjan. Thanks for mentioning "husbandless condition" which confirms that after she gave birth to Wilhelm in 1862 out of wedlock that she remained unmarried 21 years later in 1883 - I have been aware of the "little twist" you mention ;}

Cheers,
Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

LajosReich — 2010-03-10 07:26:29Z

Richard,
I have not too much time now, only would like to ask: did you see the maps, what I sent?
I think, I did not write enough clean, forgive me.
Czechland is written as Csehország. It is from word to word means "Czechish country" So, understand the present Czech Republic. The name of the town is written later, under the name of Julianna, but that means nothing.
More later.The official name of your Crompachy was not in yours' age, please, understand. It was Korompa, and the Krompachy is a simple name sininimising to Slav/Slovak.

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

otthoniskola — 2010-03-10 07:12:20Z

In the first document the names are IVANEK Vilmos, Chech coalminer, and MURGACS Julianna, from Krompach. Their residence seems to have been Bikabikk, a coal mine, or probably just a temporary camp near it. The old mine is near Salgotarjan, they organize hiking tours from there that include the site of the mine: (http://karcag.szuperinfo.hu/pdf/1040/2009/08/14.pdf)
As for the 1883 certificate, that may give a little twist to your family history: in the bottom note MARKOVICS Marton certifies that the above mother, IVANIK Franciska, resides in Baglyosallya (Heves county, see: http://mek.niif.hu/02100/02163/html/2kot/25r36fej.htm) and she is in a "husbandless condition"... a fact reinforced by the entry under Unehelich at the top. :)

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-10 06:37:12Z

This is the baptism certificate I tried to attach before.

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-10 06:34:55Z

Hi,

I am sure of the Iwanik or Ivanik spelling of the name based on my great-grandfather's baptism certificate (I tried to attach without success) from Leoben, Austria. It is in German, with a notation in Hungarian at the bottom from a priest in Salgotarjan dated 1883. I believe he had that copy of the certificate made to present to the church in Salgotarjan when they moved there from Austria, possibly when he was preparing to marry.

Regarding Hochheide: In some brief handwritten notes (from around 1935) left by my grandmother, the word “Hochhide” is barely visible, since it was erased. She also wrote the words “Duisburg” and “Homberg am Rhine.” Duisburg is in Germany only a few miles from the towns of Hochheide and Homberg (which is on the Rheine River), and is also very near the well-known city of Dusseldorf. They sailed to America from Antwerp, which is not far from there.

There are also the words “Girard” and “Murgach.” ***I now realize that she was writing the maiden name of her mother: "Murgacs" shown on her baptism certificate.*** (I do not yet know the significance of "Girard.")

The Ivaniks in America used different spellings over time: Evanik, Evanick, Ivanick, Ivanic.

Thanks for the Slovakia web site. And thanks for helping stimulate my brain to put together a few more pieces of this puzzle!

Cheers,
Richard

Re: IVANIK/IWANCK

ZlaticaBeca — 2010-03-09 22:37:51Z

Richard

I do think that Karancskeszi's church records will provide you with a spelling of the surnames. I do not see Vilmos's surname as IVANIK but the handwriting is sort of fancy. Maybe IVANIK was written with German grammar in mind. {?}
I see Rozsnyo; Nograd; Karancskeszi on the document.
Rozsnyo, Gomork megye, Hungary is Roznava, SK
Nograd megye
map: http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910/nograd.jpg
Karancskeszi, Nograd megye, Hungary
http://www.karancskeszi.hu/
http://www.zeleznice.net/
Your ancestor being a miner by occupation does not make your (re)search simpler.

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ZlaticaBeca — 2010-03-09 21:48:10Z

Richard

I only know of www.zoznamst.sk for SK's phone book.
I too did not find any NURGAC, MURGAC. Did find MURGAS^. Very small number of IVANIK. I would recommend starting in Karanszkezi and then branch out to Slovakia.
Iwanck, Anna 14 1888 1902
Iwanck, Irma 3 1899 1902
Iwanck, Julianna 12 1890 1902
Iwanck, Julie 36 1866 1902
Iwanck, Karl 8 1894 1902
Iwanck, Wilhelm 40 1862 1902
Iwanck, Wilhelmina 5 1897 1902 These family is listed Lower Austria; last residence Hochleide/Hochheide. You saying this is in Germany not in Lower Austria? I am not cleark on the spelling of IVANIK. I see it as IVOZNEK Vilmos on the baptismal certificate.
Check out this site for research in Slovakia:
www.iabsi.com/gen/public

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-09 21:40:06Z

Hi again Lajos,

You mention "Ivarnik Vilmos (Villiam Ivarnik)miner from Czechland." Do you clearly see "Czechland," and was that a proper way to refer to that area in those days?
Also, I am sure the name is Ivanik - the person writing seems to have made complicated "a" letters that could look like "ar."

Thanks,
Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-09 21:33:39Z

Hi Lajos,

Thanks for the information about the "little 3-s."
And your writing is clear - don't worry about any mistakes.

Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-09 21:17:20Z

Hi Lajos Reich,

Thanks for your very useful comments. Another person responding to my original post suggested that Krompach is actually Krompachy in Slovakia. Krompachy was also known as Krompach and it is 195 km from Salgotarjan, Nograd where the Ivanik family lived. Also, in the 1930 US census the birthplace of Julianna Ivanik, and that of her parents, is shown as "Slovania" (I am sure this means Slovakia). So, I will look into Krompach, Czech Rep. as well as Krompachy, Slovakia.
Indeed the first born daughter Vilmos and Julianna Ivanik was Anna, which is the paternal grandmother's name. The second born was Julianna (mother's name) Terez (godmother's name). The first son I believe was "Toni" (family records not clear for him), which was the name of the paternal grandfather (Anton). After that, however, the next born son was Leo Karl, and not Vilmos. They had many children, so there may have been a Vilmos who died early.
Vilmos (Wilhelm)Ivanik was born near Leoben, Austria in 1862. His mother and grandparents came from Zeleznice, Jicin, (current) Czech Rep. No father is shown on his baptism certificate (which I have a copy). He and his mother and perhaps grandparents moved to the Salgotarjan area in about 1883. They were miners - Wilhelm continued to be a miner when they immigrated to America.
My research continues and I hope to make a trip to Hungary in June this year to follow up locally.
I would very much like to write to the authorities in Karancskeszi, but I hesitate to do so without being able to speak or write Hungarian.
Again, thank you.
Cheers,
Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

LajosReich — 2010-03-09 20:48:03Z

Richard,
those little "3"-s no more, like ornaments, like in the archaic Latin books the initiales.
These ornaments are making many times to be unreadable the baptismal records and other certificates. By the same cause I can not read the name of the town, which's district was the "Kőszénbányatelep", and I am not absolute sure by the name Ivanik or Ivarnik? I think the Ivarnik is good, but maybe that you know better..
By this cause was developed in the beginning of the 20th Century the "nice-writing" in the basic schools. Sorry, it was stoped at 1951, and in this way I could learn it only one year - but I am quite proud of my nice writing also today.
Lajos
PS: I made some spelling mistake in my first letter, hope it will not be troublesome.

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

LajosReich — 2010-03-09 20:33:47Z

Richard,
this extract of a baptismal record is as interesting, as which the people can meet very rare.
First before the all you have to know, that Slovakia is exist from 1993, so when this paper was written, Slovakia was not. When the Historical Hungary was cuted up by the idea of the president oöf the USA, at 1920 they made a never was country: Czechoslovakia. I told you these facts only to helo for you to use the correct geographical phrases, do not think about me any bad.
About the extract.
The extract was written by Latin and Hungarian language at 9th of September at 1897 in Karancskeszi. It is absolutely as same as the original. Karancskeszi is in the present Hungary, in county Nógrád, district Szécsény You can see where it was in the Historical Hungary here:
http://href.hu/x/bq6j
The baptised baby was born at 23th of September 1890 (I hope, read well the numbers) and the baptism was at 28th day of the same month. Her name was Julianna Teréz (Juliana Theresia) born from legal marriage.
The parents are Ivarnik Vilmos (Villiam Ivarnik)miner from Czechland (!!!!!) and the mother was Julianna Murgács (Juliana Murgach) from Krompach. Krompach is in the present Czech Republik very near to the German border, se the page:
http://href.hu/x/bq72
So, it looks like they came from the same country and same town, but tokk marriage in Hungary.
They were Roman Catholic.
I beg your pardon, but I can not read out the name of the "town" (Baksaháza????), but the place is the district of that town, was named "Kőszéntelep" means from word to word: "Sea-coal-settlement" It was/is frequent, that around the mines was developed a settlement, where the houses of the mine-leaders and minres houses were. I will try to ask the Nógrád archive, what could be the name of the town, where this settlement wasThe Godparents were Sprnko Ferenc (Ferenc Spirko)miner and hes wife Novoszat Teréz (Theresia Novosat)both of them Roman Catholic. The baptiser was Paulik Béla (the Béla is an ancient Hungarian firstname) káplán (chaplan)
The baptising record shows two very interesting thing:
first it is prove on nice way, that in the 19th Century, when the coal-mines around Salgótarján were found out, there were invited miner experts from Czechland. I am sure, if you write to the local government of Karancskeszi, they will like it.
Their address is: 3183 Karancskeszi, Fő út 69. Europe - Hungary.
I am not sure, but maybe these e-addresses are working:
karancskeszi@xmail.profinter.hu
The other interesting to see exactly the Hungarian namegiving custom, what shows, they took up some Hungarian traditions. In Hungary the custom was, that the first son got the Father's name, sometimes the Grandfather's or Godfather's name, same by the daughters: she got first firstnamne by her mom, then second firstname by her Godmom...Have a good research!
Lajos Reich, Hungary

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-09 19:38:36Z

Looking at that name with fresh eyes, I think it's Murgács. There are a few people with that surname in the Hungarian online phone book. However I don't find any such persons in the Slovakia directory (http://telefonny.zoznam.sk/ - do you know a better online directory for Slovakia?). Nor do I find any Nurgács in Hungary.
I found the Ivanik family arrival in 1902 in the EI Foundation records under the name Iwanck. They apparently spent some time in Hochheid,Germany before departing for America.
Previously I found addresses of several persons with the surname Ivanik/Ivanic in Slovakia in the online directory and was thinking of writing to them to ask if they were related to the Ivaniks from Salgotarjan (that's the town they actually lived in - near Karancskezi). Do you have suggestions as to whether that might prove useful? If so do you have suggestions as to how I might get a brief letter translated into Slovak?
I am just getting started with the LDS records and plan today to order several microfilms I have found in their catalog (I am adding Krompachy to the list - thanks to you!).
Thanks again for your help and taking an interest in my Hungarian ancestor search.
Cheers,
Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ZlaticaBeca — 2010-03-09 14:57:31Z

You'r welcome Richard

Maybe the little 3 before a N is a way the writer wrote a letter N. Does it make sense for the surname to be NUZGACS ?
Did your IVANIK ancestor arrive thru NY EI? If yes, I am not finding it.
Did you already go thru Karancskeszi's church records?

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-09 06:28:34Z

Hi Zlatica Beca,

Thanks so much for your help with this. I didn't realize that Krompach was a town in Slovakia, since that part of the document didn't ask for the person's place of origin (rather it asks for occupation, and Krompach didn't make sense).
I have also struggled to decipher the first letter of Julianna's surname. Do you understand what the litle backwards 3 symbol means in front of that letter? I see the same symbol at the beginning of Nograd (Varmegye) in the upper right of the document.
I am requesting the Kompachy microfilm from LDS, and since I have Julianna's exact birthdate, maybe I can find her baptism certificate using the last letters of her surname. She is my great-grandmother who immigrated to the US (Illinois) in 1902 with her husband William Ivanik (my great-grandfather) and children.
Thanks again for your help - the web site you suggested is also very helpful.
Cheers,
Richard

Re: Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ZlaticaBeca — 2010-03-09 04:04:01Z

Richard

You can use www.bmi.net/jjaso for church wording
The document does list Julianna's parents names and location.
For the mother's name Julianna ?UZGACS or ?URGACS, Krompach
Krompach is Krompachy, Slovakia:
Krompachy SN/KI spiš.
1773 Krompachinu[m], Krompak, Krombach, Krompachj, 1786, 1863–1902 Krompach, 1808 Krompach, Krompachy, 1907–1913 Korompa, 1920– Krompachy {all the names this town was known by}

Hungarian Baptism Certificate

ainsrow1 — 2010-03-08 19:59:19Z

I am trying to decipher part of my grandmother's baptism certificate from 1890 in Hungarian handwriting. Of particular interest is the name of her mother. Her mother's given name is Julianna (clearly seen), but I am trying to determine if the surname is also shown. I cannot make out the word before her given name, if indeed it is her surname. Is there someone who can help with this?
Thanks, Richard

Stephen & Gertrude Lucas - from Austria/Croatia? How to trace back to there?

ml29618964 — 2010-03-08 19:17:10Z

I have searched the whole Lucas message board back to the beginning. It appears that most Lucases come from the UK. However, Stephen/Stephan Sr. and Gertrude Lucas (my great-grandparents) emigrated from "Austria" and spoke "Croatian" (according to the 1910 census forms). Might their names have been changed/"Americanized" upon entry into the US? Does anyone have any suggestions how to go back in time tracing Stephen Sr. and Gertrude to Austria or Croatia?
Stephen Sr. and Gertrude had two children in Austria; Joseph and Barbara. Stephen Sr. came to America in ~1889; Getrude followed with the two children in ~1900. Upon her arrival, they had two more children; Stephen Jr. (my grandfather) and Anthony.
I have posted this message in both the Austria and the Croatia message boards, as well as the Lucas family name message board, on 8 March 2010. Feel free to contact me at mmbmj@msn.com if you would like to discuss.

Re: CENK

ZlaticaBeca — 2010-03-07 20:29:03Z

wyanicko

Cenk, Dominseo Carovilli 16 1885 1901
Cenk, Joh 58 1834 1892
Cenk, Matya Krasic 31 1862 1893
Cenk, Stiepan Krasic 31 1862 1893 view www.ellisislandrecords.org

CENK

RobertJerin — 2010-03-07 13:53:32Z

Is this your John CENK?

WW I Draft Registration
Name: John Cenk
Birth Date: 21 Apr 1881
Birth Place: Semslei
Residence: Oakmont, Allegheny, Pennsylvania

And from the 1930 Kensington PA Census
Cenk, John (b: 1881*) born Czechoslovakia speaks German arrived US 1909
Household: Cenk, John (b: 1910*)
Cenk, Pauline (b: 1914*)

There place called Berek in Croatia and also one in present day Hungary, both the old Kingdom of Croatia and the old Kingdom of Hungary were parts of the old Austria-Hungary.

What was John's brother's name?

What was John's ethnicity? Do you know his religion? Does anyone recall words or phrases he used? These may all help in finding his place of origin.

Also John is an Americanized name... could have been Johann, Janos, Jan, Ivan, depending on where he was from.

Also the surname could have been CENK, CSENK, CZENK, CINK, CSINK, CZINK... again depending on where he was from

Robert Jerin
Croatian Heritage Museum
Cleveland Ohio

Re: Looking for ancestors in Europe

halpark — 2010-03-07 12:18:13Z

I believe Berek is in Croatia. This was part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. You might do better on the Croatia board.

Re: Warga

LajosReich — 2010-03-05 21:07:37Z

Hí Robert,
how are you? I am still fighting.
The Varga is an archaic name of a mastership, and its origine is the archaic finno-ugrian word varr (sew).
The vargas were originally leather makers, who also made the white leathers, About from the 16th Century the vargas made not only leathers, but shoes. Of course in that age these shoes were mostly boots... (These boots are made for walking... :-) )
Later the bootmakers have been stronger in the market, and the people also presently are naming the bootmakers as csizmadia, which will not unknown surname for you.
Commonly were two variety of the vargas by their jobs:
the "magyar varga (Hungarian varga) made the leathers for the boot- and shoemakers, and for the saddlers, repaired the old shoes, boots. The Német varga (German varga) made the finer shoes, later repaired them, more later it assimilated to the job and word: cipész (shoemaker)
The varga, as a job's name is very frequent everywhere in the Hungarian language territories and of course in the descendant countries - many of the nameusers are not Hungarian and does not know, what the name means... In America it is writtem usually as Vargo, too.

Re: Warga

LajosReich — 2010-03-05 20:27:58Z

It would be good to see the original handwiting of the towns Rozanys and Holsdorf. I am afraid, there are some spelling mistake. If they are, I try to read out of the Hungarian writing.
Lajos

Re: Warga

RobertJerin — 2010-03-04 02:52:09Z

This was done with my subscription to Ancestry.com

Prior to the end of WW I (1918) both what is now present day Austria and present day Hungary were part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire aka Austria-Hungary. And it is not uncommon for US records to show Austria, or Hungary or one of the succesor countries such as Czechoslovakia now Czech Republic and Slovak Republic. I am fairly certain he came from a place north of Bratislavia Slovkia.

As the other poster mentioned the name was originally VARGA in addition to the meaning of shoemaker here is what Ancestry.com has to say about the name
Hungarian: occupational name from Hungarian varga ‘cobbler’, ‘shoemaker’. It is also found as a Slovenian surname in easternmost Slovenia.
Czech and Slovak: nickname for a miserable or complaining person, from vargat ‘lament’, ‘moan’, ‘complain’.
Slovak and Ukrainian: descriptive nickname from varga ‘lip’. Compare Polish Warga.

One of the census records shows that William was a Naturalized US Citizen. You may want to search the St Louis data base at....

http://www.slcl.org/branches/hq/sc/nat/nat-project.htm#after

I am attaching a City Directory page, from 1910 which shows Rosa listed as a grocer (widowed by this time) I don't see Moses in any directory... nor do I find the family until about 1909 in any directory

Darn... we just returned from Sacramento CA ! We visited my mother and sister .... and quilt shops... and I went searching for places and cemeteries were early Croatian immgirants lived.... in the Mother Lode country...

Thanks for the invite

Robert Jerin
Croatian Heritage Museum
Cleveland Ohio

Re: Warga

Ohsuzi — 2010-03-04 01:27:53Z

OMG That is the most info I have ever had. How did you do that! I am such a novice anyway.On the copy of my g-fathers paperwk that was left to me, it says he was born in Austria. No town or when he came over with his family. I am sooooooo grateful. You ever need a place to stay in California, there is a place here with your name on it. You have to tell me how to find out more, please. Thank you thank you!

Re: Warga

RobertJerin — 2010-03-03 23:45:43Z

The given name is more likely Bela (an old Hungarian name)

Is this your William Bela WARGA?

Home in 1910: St Louis Ward 24, St Louis (Independent City), Missouri
Rosa Warga 46 widow arr US 1905 as did all children
Oscar Warga 22
Robert V Warga 20
Bela Warga 17
Hilda R Warga 15
All born Hungary, listed as German

WW I Draft Registration
Name: Wm B Warga
City: St Louis
County: St Louis (Independent City)
State: Missouri
Birthplace: Holsdorf Hungary
Birth Date: 24 Apr 1892
Race: Caucasian (White)

It appears the family arrived via the Port of Baltimore
VARGA, Moses age 46 occupation Joiner
Rosa age 43
Oscar age 17 occupation Joiner
Bela age 11
Hilda age 10
Race: Magyar (Hungarian)
Port of Departure: Bremen, Germany
Ship Name: Hannover
Port of Arrival: Baltimore, Maryland
Destination: St Louis,MO
Friend's Name: Johann Francz
Last Residence: Rozanys, Hungary

1930 census St Louis
Name Age
William Warga 37 born Czechoslakia father born Czech morther born Germany language spoken at home Yiddish
Sylvia Warga 37
Mildred Warga 11
Frances Warga 6

He was likely born in what is now Slovakia

Robert Jerin

Re: Warga

Mohnbauerin — 2010-03-03 15:50:01Z

the original name Varga is hungarian and means shoemaker.
http://www.petar-zulj.iz.hr/html/engleski/prezimena/varga.ph...
Warga is a germanized form.

Warga

Ohsuzi — 2010-03-02 18:52:14Z

Looking for any relatives whose Warga's came over from Austria around the early 1900's. I have a picture and it seems my g-father had 2 other brothers & 1 sister.I don't know there names. His name was William Bala Warga. Settled in St. Louis, MO.In photo my G-F is the one on the far right.He was about 14y when he came over with his family.
Any news would be great.
Ohsuzi@msn.com

Re: Looking for Pollreisz

anyatart — 2010-03-02 02:08:51Z

John G was my grandfather!! This is my family only some of the documents misspell the last name and some list the parents to be born in Hungary! I may have to start changing the way the name is spelled and see what I find.

Re: Trying to find a location in Austria

2010-02-28 17:57:18Z

Hi Christine,
I'm sorry but I haven't been able to find much else about my family. I've seen this surname spelt differently from my family. I still don't know where this location is (SEREDNE). If you know, please let me know. Good luck on your search.

Re: Looking for ancestors in Europe

wyanicko — 2010-02-28 15:12:43Z

Looking for relatives of John Cenk who came to the US. His Mother Theresa and Father Wendell lived in maybe Berek, Austria Hungary. This Berek was listed on his brother's naturalization papers.

Re: Louis Schwartz of Romania

jschwart144 — 2010-02-27 22:14:49Z

The only information that I have of my great uncle Louis is that the family lived in Iasi and Birlad Romania. Jonathan

Re: Louis Schwartz of Romania

ajginsberg — 2010-02-27 17:35:33Z

My ggrandfather Ascher Louis Schwartz and he was from Bacau. He emigrated to the US NY. He married Ida (yehudis ginsburg) around 1890 in the US. They had four children Leah (Lillie), Tillie, Maurice who died in WWI and my grandmother Florence (Blimmel). Lillie and Tillie both married men named Schwartz.

Re: Zemancik married Simandl

RobertJerin — 2010-02-27 15:26:29Z

Correct spelling as per manifest is Katarina

The manifest shows that Katarina and the children had been in the US from 1901-1903 and that the family was held at Ellis Island for 4 days Their Race is listed as Slovak.

Czechoslovakia did not exist until after WW I, 1918

The name SIMANDL on the manifest was recorded at the port of departure from a passport carried by Katarina

There are several manifests showing the arrival of Anton (not Antoine) in various years inc. one in 1903. He was also detained and that page lists goitre as the reason One of his manifest lists Ujogradina as his place of origin. In any case the place is not in Czechoslovakia as Krasso-Szoreny Megye (megye = county) is now in Romania or Serbia

Antoine is French... link to European given names Also the spelling Katryn is neither Slovak nor Czech

http://sciway3.net/scgenweb/oconee-county/archived-pdf/zoom-...

Even in the 1910 VA census they did not have an E This census gives Anton and Catherine's arrival year as 1893

Name Age
Anton Simandl 50
Catherine Simandl 46
John Simandl 17
Antone P Simandl 4
Mary Simandl 10

WW I Draft Registration
Name: John Simandle
County: Wise
State: Virginia
Birthplace: British Columbia;Canada
Birth Date: 21 Apr 1893

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Or%C5%9Fova

Using Hungarian spelling you may find a variant to be SZIMANDL.

Some else is researching Anton SIMANDL

http://www.iarelative.com/czech/sea0599a.htm

Social Security Death records

Anthony Simandle 25 Apr 1897 Died Oct 1969 Sacramento, Sacramento, California

John Simandle 21 Apr 1893 Died May 1975 Sylmar, Los Angeles, California

You may wish to post to the Romania and Hungary board. The Austria board is really meant for the area that is now modern day Austria. Evidently your family has no connection to that territory.

Robert Jerin
Croatian Heritage Museum
Cleveland Ohio

Re: Looking for Pollreisz

RobertJerin — 2010-02-27 12:27:19Z

Could this be your Grandfather, as found in WW I Draft Registration records?

Name: Mike Joseph Pollreis
County: Hutchinson
State: South Dakota
Birth Date: 9 Mar 1899
Employer John Pollreis

Ancestry mistranscribed the record for you POLLREIZ family as found 1930 Worthen, Hanson, South Dakota They are living next to Albert POLLREIZ family

Name Age
Micke Pollreisy 30 born Nebraska parents born Austria
Laura M Pollreisy 24
John G Pollreisy 5
Micheal L Pollreisy 4
Mary A Pollreisy 1 4/12

Robert

Zemancik married Simandl

msjbishop — 2010-02-27 03:07:58Z

Hello, my father's mother's family came thru Ellis Island in 19 May 1905.
They were Mother: Catharine -Katryn- ZEMANCIK
I have no idea who her parents are.
Birth abt 1864 in Austria-Hungary Bohemian
Oldest son: John Simandle Birth
21 Apr 1893 in Canada
2nd son:Anthony Peter Simandle Birth
25 Apr 1897 in Orsova, Austria Hungary
and my grandmother
Mary Agnes SIMANDLE BISHOP
Birth 16 Jul 1900 in Nova Agradena, Orsova, Krasso-Szoreny Megye, Hungary Death: 26 Nov 1995 in Elizabethton, Carter, Tennessee, United States of America
I think they added the "e" on the end of their name after Ellis Island. They came to meet the father who was here:
Antoine (Anthony) Simandle Birth
abt 1860 in Czechoslovakia; Austria; Magyarorszag (Hungary)
If anyone knows of this family I would love to hear from you.
Thank you,
Julie
http://trees.ancestry.com/tree/12666369/person/-207840040

Re: Christineck, Krystenek, Christinneck, Christeineck, Christinecke, Christinek, Michaelis

JeanneLorf — 2010-02-26 15:02:06Z

Thanks! I did find "Christinecke" listed on that website! That is my first confirmation of any crest/nobility that I have come across. It is listed as "WMH2 - 094 - 4027 - 443". Now where do I find more info for this? Do they have more information for these listed families, regarding these crests? Perhaps Brandenburg has a central office for more nobility information?

Jeanne

Re: Seredne & Dubravka

julia41222 — 2010-02-25 21:59:17Z

There is a Dubrovka in Slovakia and one in Ukraine. I ordered the records and they were not from Ukraine. The one in Ukraine is now spelled Dubrivka.

website

Mohnbauerin — 2010-02-25 16:54:24Z

found the english version:
http://www.wappen-billet.de/index_english.htm

Re: Christineck, Krystenek, Christinneck, Christeineck, Christinecke, Christinek, Michaelis

Mohnbauerin — 2010-02-25 16:48:52Z

Krystenek don´t think, because not german, but i also thought maybe it would be a variant like Kristineck.
maybe you ask this person - he paints coat of arms and think knows a lot about nobility in germany. maybe he knows more or he knows other persons who are knowing much more about nobility. e-mail on end of page. he often writes in genealogy-forums. hope this helps:
http://www.wappen-billet.de/

Re: Christineck, Krystenek, Christinneck, Christeineck, Christinecke, Christinek, Michaelis

JeanneLorf — 2010-02-25 01:35:27Z

Thanks for the websites. Michaelis is listed all over the place for nobility. I do know my Christinecks attended University of Halle and Michaelis are also connected to that University.

My great great great great grandmother Christiane Elisabeth Michaelis was born in 1714 and married in 1733 in Haseloff, Brandenburg. She was Johann Andreas Christineck's second wife. Her father was Christian Ernst Michaelis and he was a Burgermeister of Jessen in Sachsen-Anhalt. I estimate he was born around 1680s.

Krystenek could also be another way to spell Christineck.

I appreciate all your help!
Jeanne
jeannelinley2000@yahoo.com

Re: "...birth/marriage/death records for Czech/Bohemia/Austria-Hungary?"

JeanneLorf — 2010-02-21 22:52:12Z

Yes, Friedrich Cristos Christineck born 1650 is definately my ancestor as I've gotten the birth records on all of them.

The Page One brief family history was indeed written by my grandfather in 1912. He was not a frivolous man and wouldn't have embellished on this history. He was a very serious businessman.

My reward is that my grandfather's history led me into the joy of genealogy!
Jeanne

"...birth/marriage/death records for Czech/Bohemia/Austria-Hungary?"

TomSalony — 2010-02-21 22:02:12Z

Hi, Jeanne,

It looks like you have been having a long successful search over the years!

The only reason I looked at your query was that it's on one of the boards I always read, just trying to learn what I can about searching for MY Slovak ancestors.

What did spur my curiosity was your posting of the 3 Attachments, totally without any information about them. "Mohnbauerin" has commented on them already. The 1st & 2nd ( being in a language I can't read and discussing a time I have little interest in ), I'll leave for others much more expert than I, but the 3rd fascinates me.

Do you know for sure who typed the "LORF:" info, and when?
I'm guessing it was your grandfather: "My grandfather was Christian Gottlieb Lorf born 1854 in Buko next to Serno. He wrote the brief family history about Princes/Princess with the help of my Aunt Alice in 1912. He remembered his father and a close Christineck cousin born 1814, diligently searched for records of the family. My grandfather died 1934 in Detroit."

Whoever provided the information held at least one of his ancestors in very high esteem. [ "...a man of high intelligence...would have left no stone unturned...welcomed documentary evidence no matter in what tongue...no obstacle." ]

I guess what I wonder is if YOUR documentation that you've obtained over the years PROVES TO YOU that Princess Christina and her son Prince Christineck are actually your ancestors? Was the inability of some "English lawyer" to find the estate{ because that not-held-in-high-esteem son of Prince Christineck burned the records), merely the loss of the family fortune, but NOT a break in your genealogy?

Please don't think I'm doubting your work; it is way beyond my interest and understanding! I'm just curious how you interpret this particular family lore, considering all the documentation you have been able to find.

Thanks.

Tom